THE PRO’S & CON’S OF FLOYD MAYWEATHER
February 24th, 2010 By Kevin Perry
Los Angeles, CA- To set the record straight, this scribe is not the biggest admirer of the world’s best pound for pound “boxer” Floyd “I Need Da’ Money” Mayweather (40-0, 25 KOs). In an effort show fairness to an athlete that has done what he was supposed to “win his fights” I will go over the Pro’s and Con’s of “Pretty Boy” Floyd. As much as the guy gets hated on by the media and the public, he deserves some credit for having a unique personality that generates a lot of attention.
PRO’S
1) Boxing IQ
There is no fighter who adjusts to a style the way Floyd does. He fights in an improvisational manner, takes few risks and receives little if any punishment in fights. Oh yeah, did I mention he is unbeaten?
2) Conditioning
One way to determine a fighter or an athletes dedication to their sport is by how keep themselves in shape. In boxing, where an athlete must constantly make weight this is even more essential to success. To this day Mayweather has yet to show up for a fight less than 100%, unless he has had hand issues. In my humble opinion, Floyd does respect the sport in which he applies his trade.
3) Charity work
While known for his love of strip clubs, gambling and “making it rain” money also gives back to the community. His Floyd Mayweather foundation has programs such as Fight for Your Education, which will include various workshops in the Nevada area for K-12 students in financial literacy, life skills, and writing. Joi’s Diamonds is a mentoring program for young women. The foundation also feeds the homeless twice a month and is involved in supplying various resources for homeless shelters. While Floyd isn’t the most likable guy on the surface, with some research there seems to be a side that does exhibit some form of humanity.
CON’S
1) Attitude
For a guy that wants to teach youth about financial responsibility, it seems almost hypocritical when he gambles excessively, throws money around and creates a negative image of himself. The way he berates his opponents by putting them down and also his arrogance make him hard to like. He sometimes comes off more like a spoiled rich kid than the thug persona that he sometimes tries to exhibit. His interview with ESPN’s Brian Kenny and on satellite radio with underground rapper RA the Rugged Man are interesting to say the least as they provide insight into his character. If they are unfamiliar to you I have provided them below.
2) Selection of opponents
It is fair to say the dislike of Floyd for the part comes from former fans who got sick of the “risk vs reward” approach Floyd has taken with his career since his close battles at lightweight with Jose Luis Castillo (60-9-1, 52 KOs). His bouts against Sharmba Mitchell (57-6,30 KOs), Henry Bruseles (28-3-1,15 KOs) and Carlos Baldomir (45-12-6, 14 KOs) left fans far less than satisfied.
3) Style
Considering “Pretty Boy” is undefeated means his style is obviously effective. However the reason why Floyd is the best “boxer” pound for pound and not the best “fighter” is because he cares more about victory than entertaining fans. The Grand Rapids, MI native and Las Vegas resident has (and continues to have) hand problems and that has been a deterrent to him letting his hands go. I think it’s a general consensus that Floyd Mayweather is not an exciting fighter because he doesn’t possess punching power, fights defensively, and fights tactically. Whatever you’re doing Floyd keep doing it because at the end of the day people still pay to watch you fight.
Kevin Perry
If you’re a Mayweather hater watch him vs. Emmanuel Augustus. If you want to see Floyd bleeding and taking shots this is the one for you.
Floyd supposedly avoided Margarito, so did a lot of others, I am glad they did becuase we all know what happened to Margarito. Same goes for Shane, he was using performance enhancers, lot of the boxing public seems to think Floyd made outrageous demands to get out of the Manny fight, truth is it is the other way around, he did agree to the gloves and overweight penalties, Manny on the other hand did not want to come clean and he cast a shadow of doubt over his alleged roid/epo use
Two things:
#1) “…he deserves some credit for having a unique personality that generates a lot of attention.”
So Kev, would Ted Bundy or David Berkowitz deserve some credit for having unique personalities that generate a lot of attention? Or Kim Jong-Il?
The point I’m trying to make is why would you want to give anyone credit for a disrespectful, rude, nasty, mean-spirited, arrogant, self-aggrandizing, thuggish personality that’s a bad example for any kid to follow?
Whether or not it attracts attention is beside the point. Drug-fiend singers Pete Doherty and Amy Winehouse attract attention for their “personalities” do you want to start giving them credit too?
#2) Why oh why does everybody keep crediting Floyd as the #1 BOXER in the world (as opposed to fighter – which I’m guessing everybody goes with Manny for).
Do we actually know that Floyd is the #1 boxer? How can we possibly know when he hasn’t faced a real challenge since Castillo – and whether or not he deserved the decision in the first fight is actually debateable?
The last challenge Floyd faced (Castillo) he actually, possibly wasn’t a good enough boxer to face the challenge (first time around). And in his fights since Castillo there simply hasn’t been enough competition for us to judge whether he is the best boxer.
Shane looked stupendous at lightweight against no-name opponents and so many people were calling him a great boxer. Against top-quality opposition it became obvious Shane is a great fighter but he’s not a master boxer and he’s not the greatest of the great. But we know this because Shane was willing to make the matches.
With Floyd there just isn’t enough evidence for anyone to say he’s the best boxer or fighter. And I’m telling you his bag of tricks isn’t any bigger than when he fought Castillo. Skilled pressure and inside fighting from a strong fighter will give Floyd fits… which is why Floyd has made sure he hasn’t fought anyone like that again!
Don’t forget Floyd beating Genaro Hernandez…great performance by the kid at the time…and chicanito was no joke
Warren
1) You must give credit to Floyd for his unique personality that draws attenton becuase without it HE would be Shane. Shane was a dominating force during his reign (especially after his first defeat of Delahoya) Must I remind you that everyone took him in high regard, he was respectful and distinguished, a fighter who fought all comers. BUT did he ever reach real popularity? Pac popularity? No!!! Why? Wonder why? (remember this is before the steriods)
Yet you imply that Floyd is disliked because of his personality but history shows that PBF was ignored by the public when he was destroying comp at the lower weights. Hell he couldn’t get Shane to fight him, Arum hid Cotto and many others thought he was too great a risk. Now you bring up Ted Bundy as if that’s clever. Please stop redirecting the focus of the article. That fact the article is making is that PBF was smart enought to reinvent his personality whether good or bad to make himself viable in the marketplace. Everybody makes mistakes and will continue to, even you. Stop judging and at least be objective. What you’re really saying is that PBF should be like you want him to be and bow down and kiss your ass even if it keeps him poor and unknown. If Shane couldn’t make himself marketable by being the “good” guy like Manny at the peak of his popularity, why would Floyd follow that route.
2) Castillo was PBF’s toughest fight according to many, but in no way did he lose and no way did he even burn through first gear to win either of them. To totally dismiss his other fights as if you yourself would have walked through them is laughable at best. I agree with the first post watch the Augustus fight. Hell watch any of them. Floyd is by far the best boxer of this generation. For any one to suspect his record and not question Manny’s or Cotto’s is by far bias as PBF has fought and won 20 championship fights. 50% of his fights have been championship fights!
he’s not a bad guy, the act is fake and it’s annoying. anyone who followed him early in his career knows that. his new followers who he is bringing into the sport and are buying his ppv’s are as irritating and phony as any of the fighter groupies over the years. they think the act is real. and thats why they like him. now thats funny.
that was pretty cool how you pasted those videos in there.
Warren I agree with you I mean the B.W.A.A. voted the fighter of the decade to Pacquiao then I guess the writers in Ringtalk should vote for Floyd boxer of the decade to justify how Pedro and company feels.Floyd will always have die hard fans and writers that feels that boxing should only have boxers not fighters like Pacquiao,Armstrong,Duran and all the great ones that gets hit and engages and makes boxing an exciting sport….
@coolraul
you are accusing manny just like the mayweather, what if we accuse you that you are using drugs too, are you cool with that? love him or hate him, he’s still a chicken! a fight with castillo will never be the same with sugar shane mosley, it’s just like floyd head been hit on the wall, it’s look like a suicide for him to fight mosley.
warren I think you should replace kevin perry as this websites boxing writer. You nake a lot more sense than this stooge does. Get a another job kevin! As a writer you should examine your fact before writing it. Either you write factual news. Don’t write at all. But I think you make a good vampire author.
I have been watching and attending live boxing matches for over 25 years. Floyd is not a top 50 all time great. He’s a media creation that is simply over hyped. If anyone actually thinks reality shows are remotely real, you need to get a life.
Floyd hasn’t fought a serious welterweight contender. Name one and please leave Oscar out of the equation and please don’t cite PPV numbers . Real boxing fans don’t rate fighters by how much money they make. We want to see them fight the best. Enough of this Jerry Springer, wwwf baloney.
Floyd hasn’t fought Cotto, Clotty ,Williams, Martinez, Pacquiao! who has he fought at welterweight Baldomir, Judah big deal. Until he steps up and fights Mosely (it hasn’t happened yet)he should be considered just what he is, untested!!!
You nailed it Warren. He was considered the best boxer, maybe then but not justifiably now in his comeback. Style makes boxing and if it helps in winning, so be it. Pac has that “awkwardness” in him that makes it difficult for opponents to decipher in the ring. That is why, people would want to see Pac fight Floyd because
of the obvious styles both boxers have. People want to see Pac annihilate Floyd in the ring due to the cons that described Floyd. I’m still very convinced that Floyd is really afraid to fight Pac..because simply he has never faced a superb fighter
in Pac with his 40 wins and zero loss. It will be devastating to his super ego
let alone his quest to make more money in boxing.
Floyd is an as*hole inside & outside the ring, you want kids to emulate that?
i really think the fight maywweather vs. mosley is still aint happening
I still believe Castillo beats him in their first go around, almost from round 1 to 12. It’s the biggest gift he got because he wouldn’t be bragging his “0″ if the judges got it right.
I think Trash Talkin and being confident is a good thing but there is a LIMIT.
Mayweather doesn’t CARE or understands that.
Whether Floyd wants to or not, he is a role-model for thousands and frankly a negative role-model.
@ Warren, Great points! I started to write something and saw your post. I think you touched about everything I was thinking…
The Castillo fight could have been a draw at best. Neither guy made an argument for being a clear cut winner. Floyd Mayweather is an athlete not my children’s role model. I don’t know who came up with this crap about athletes being kids role models so get over it. These atheltes are not the ones having daily contact with your children, you are so get off of that kick. As far a boxing goes, the sport has varied styles of fighting so Mayweather fights his style and every other fighter foghts theirs. Outside of a weight drained DaLa Hoya and a shot Miguel Cotto, name me 3 top fighters that Manny Pacquaio has fought. If the fight between Mayweather and Pacquaio ever happens we will probably see the ugliest fight in history. Both fighters have the skill set to make for a good fight (pure boxer vs puncher). Remember how many thought Jermain Taylor a puncher was going to walk through Winky Wright who was a pure boxer and their styles neutralized each other.
nonesense article, do u think his # boxer?or this egomaniac boxer claim it by himself?…his more than ALI?ROBINSON?as he always saying….with out this legendary boxer he’s nothing, so stop putting this fraud mayweather to a high pedestal, leave him alone on horizon and let him recognized himself coz he says he leave by himself.remenber this writer “before he makes somebody happy, he should be the first one to be happy, self preservation first” now writer are u happy or u made him happy coz u always recognize this @#@#@ boxer?if u look up M. Jordan a all time great, u never heard him going to the public and say I’m better than Chamberlain, Abdull Jabbar…etc…but people knows it that he’s #1 without saying it by himself.
ax73, you’re reading comprehension isn’t very good obviously…I think Warren and I pretty much agree, however I wanted to write a fair piece and not a Mayweather bashing story.If you are a good reader tell me what wasn’t factual about the story instead of making implications without actually providing any evidence. If you know anything about me as a writer I am one of Floyd’s harshest critics…however the guy is still a great fighter and you can’t go 40 and 0 unless yuo have skills. He has fought some good fighters, however at welterweight he has been less than stellar. I did feel a need to add some postives about Floyd…there are worse people in the world than him…if you don’t like him don’t buy his fights, that way you won’t have to line his pockets.
What you have as #1 KP is all that should be needed to earn the respect of boxing fans.
“There is no fighter who adjusts to a style the way Floyd does. He fights in an improvisational manner, takes few risks and receives little if any punishment in fights.Oh yeah, did I mention he is unbeaten?”
He’s style may not be pleasing to some, but if he gets by Mosley, I definitely don’t want to hear no excuses on how “Mosley was to old” or “They should have fought back then” bullcrap. Mosley, Margo, and Cotto were number 3, 2,1, respectively at one point, and we all know what Margo did to Cotto and then we saw what Shane did to Plasterito. SM is the rightful ruler of Welter. Mayweather has a dogfight ahead of him, and like a lot of people, I’m glad it’s about time! To tell you the truth, I’m glad to see Clottey in the run for number one and actually glad to see Mosley/Mayweather and Pac/Clottey rather than seeing just Pac/Mayweather…as long as the winner of both fights take on one another!
Slipjab 73: “Outside of a weight drained DaLa Hoya and a shot Miguel Cotto, name me 3 top fighters that Manny Pacquaio has fought”
Pac fought the baddest in his weightclass at the time of the fights when he took on Barrera, Marquez, Morales. He also K.O.’d the FLYWEIGHT Lineal champion Chatchai Sasakul.
I got a question for you though. Did you consider Cotto shot before or after the Pac fight. And if it was before, what chances did you give Cotto going into that fight?
For anybody wanting to call Mosley or Clottey “cherry picked”, do it before the fight happens please!
Great fighter but his refusal to fight the best will tarnish his legacy.
Actually, going 40-0 isn’t that hard. Sven Ottke, Brian Nielson, Butterbean, Sean O’Grady, a bunch of fighters built up stellar records fighting nobodies.
Floyd is clearly way above those guys, but the point is, better to have 10 meaningful matches than 50 meaningless ones.
Floyd has always managed to avoid the top few rough fighters surrounding his weight class, although he has demolished a lot of very good fighters like Hatton, Gatti, Judah and Corrales.
Floyd will either prove he’s a great fighter if he beats Shane on May 1, or prove otherwise, that he’s not that great if he loses, specially if its by knockout. Just 65 more days to go guys, can’t wait…
people dont seem to get it about floyd! he not a bad guy outside the ring , i’ve have been telling people for yrs about floyd!…that he does alot of good things outside the ring! this bad guy image is just for attention but he seems to love it and because it works. because he is the guy u love to hate.
Obviously, Pacquiao did not want to play Mayweather’s mind games. Besides, he can afford to not take the fight because his earnings already dwarfs that of Mayweather. Aside from being a great athlete, he is also a better person than Floyd is. More Cons: Remember Floyd’s troubles from the law stemming from domestic violence in 2002? Remember that misdemeanor battery involving two women in 2004? How about that fight with bouncer inside a club? That tells a lot about the character of the person. That is why I was not surprised at all when he started those insinuations against Pacquiao. In addition, Floyd is having trouble with the IRS (more cons). Which leads me to ask Floyd the same obvious question: How come you wasted $40 million by not fighting Pacquiao? Given Floyd’s reputation of ducking good fighters, the answer is a very obvious one.
KP, you axed ax73. Nice one.
KP, If the boxing writers (experts who cover and know best about the sport)voted overwhelmingly the Pacman as Fighter of the year and Fighter of the DECADE, then any claim that from a self-proclaimed fighter or a scribe supporter can not hold water. You opening remark that Floyd is no. 1 P4P boxer somehow contradicts your assertion of fairness and beings unbiased. I suggest you desist from making those remarks if the experts and boxing enthusiasts all over the world believe and know otherwise. Why else would Floyd keep on bashing Pacman in his interviews? Simply because he knows public opinion has turned against him and his random testing demands backfired. You see plainly that it really bothers him no end, because he is very touchy on the issue, and even brings it up when it is not the topic. Floyd’s always on the defensive and now tries to justify with his mouth what he failed to do with his heart and fists. If you insist he’s the best, try convincing all those expert scribes who voted for pacman. Sorry, but now you see why you are in the minority.
This article is the typical crap that every Mayweather hater has been saying about Mayweather for years. The Mayweather haters remind me of bible thumpers. They mention the parts that support their opinion and ignore the parts that shoot their opinions to hell. This writer criticizes Mayweather for his attitude. Have you seen any of those Brian Kenny or Larry Merchant interviews where Kenny and Merchant attacked Mayweather for avoiding Hatton and Baldomir? When he fought them, they accused him of avoiding Cotto and Margarito. Have you seen how Larry Merchant cricicizes Mayweather in every fight and rarely and grudgingly give him any credit, and you talk about Mayweather’s attitude. Muhammad Ali was criticized for his attitude and his attitude was arguably worse(his arrogance, his belittling of opponents such as call Joe Frazier an Uncle Tom, etc.). So have a lot of other fighters. So what? Its part of the business. This writer criticizes him for his style. A lot of people like his style and watch him because of his style, so there is no “general consensus” about him having a boring style. If there were, he wouldn’t be on PPV and wouldn’t be making the type of money that he is making. In terms of his selection of opponents since Castille, he wanted to fight both Cotto and Hatton at 140. Their promoters turned the fight down. He tried to get a fight with Mosley, who turned it down several times. He beat the number 1 and two Ring Magazine welterweights (Baldomir and Judah) and idiots like this criticize him for not fighting the number 3 (Margarito). He fought Oscar on Oscar’s terms and beat him. This article has a lot more cons than Mayweather.
The intractable mind of floyd and his championing thought of cleaning the sports was so abrupt and without any previous undertaking is maybe the contributary factor of
his mixed image to the fans by en large.
floyd mayweather is a walking list of excuses. the guy could have been one of the best of all time but because he didnt choose to fight the best fighters of his era, he is only among the greatest in his mind. he prefered to not take big risks continuously and very carefully chose opponents he knew he would beat that would make him look his best. unfortunately for floyd and his legacy, pacquiao started moving up and knocking everybody out. bottom line, floyd claims to be the best yet he has not/did not fight the following fighters through the years: MANNY PACQUIAO, miguel cotto, paul williams, antonio margarito, shane mosley, luis collazo, joshua clottey, carlos quintana, kermit cintron, vernon forrest, joel casamayor, kostya tszyu. his toughest fights have been against castillo (many people believe castillo won their first fight), judah and a somewhat-over-the-hill de la hoya. of course he could not have fought all of them, but if he really wanted to be remembered as one of the best he should have made sure he fought his share of the best fighters, which he did not.
Nobody can beat Floyd Mentally. If you watch his 24/7 series you can hear him saying “When i’m at the top, i ain’t trying to look toward the bottom to see who’s there. You better worry about getting in my spot” He is mentally tough.
@slipjab73, please review his fight against Ricky Hatton and ask yourself again if he is a truly pure boxer or a karate cheating kid… http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWNC7IJ-tL8 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqldHEJ4p7U&feature=related
Floyd is not the best boxer that some people think he is. Pacman will kill him in the ring, for sure.
“you can’t go 40 and 0 unless you have skills”- are you saying cesar chavez jr is a very skilled boxer? He is 40 – 0 like mayweather.
“In boxing, where an athlete must constantly make weight this is even more essential to success. To this day Mayweather has yet to show up for a fight less than 100%” – How about that Marquez fight where he came in 102% (2 lbs over weight)? Does that count?
Clottey is probably the weakest unknown welter around. Cherry picking Floyd? Yes! But cherry picking Manny too!
The mention of the unique personality that generates attention I think speaks more to the state of the sport than a pro or con for the individual fighter.
If boxing was big enough such that the only thing that mattered was who you fought and how you did, there would be no place for personality.
That’s not the reality of the situation. Boxing needs race and attitude to sell in addition to being a competitive matchup because there are so few competitive matchups.
Think about it, in any given year of boxing, you really only get an handful of quality competitive matchups and one of those is “fight of the year”.
In any other sport, you are likely to see good close games every weekend!
1200 Techs “I got a question for you though. Did you consider Cotto shot before or after the Pac fight. And if it was before, what chances did you give Cotto going into that fight?”
Cotto was shot after the Margarito fight. No one can sustain that type of beating and be the same afterwards. If you look at Cotto’s fight with Clottey, he barely got by. As much as I think Freddy Roach is a prick the one thing that even he picked up on and even said in an interview was that Cotto was not the same boxer. I didn’t think Cotto was going to be beat as bad as he was but I did expect him to be too slow for Pacquaio. Cotto took too much demage in back to back fights not to mention the Pacquaio fight. He is pretty much damaged goods.
I respect Mayweather as a fighter, and I respect his charity work. I even see his “act” being good marketing (like professional wrestling). However, the reason he comes off as ignorant when he gets into arguments is because he IS ignorant. He’s like a fish out of water trying to prove a point, using the same old tired arguments and excuses. Did he finish High School? He seems to want to prove his points using intelligence, but he has no ammunition. It’s like he’s having a temper tantrum.
Rasheed, I am a boxing fan, not a PBF fan, I think there is a good chance that PBF might lose against Mosley, Mosley destroyed Margarito, nobody gave him a chance against Margarito, Margarito without the wraps could not do much damage, I had the Mosley Cotto fight as a draw. Cotto being in wars with Zab, Mosley and Margarito the cheater was alraedy damaged and it did not help that he had to come down to fight manny. I think Mosley has a batter chance to beat PBF than Manny, so what’s all this PBF is a chicken comments about. I am not accusing Manny of drugs, but if Usain Bolt & Michael phelps can squash all kinds of drug talk by repeteadly subjecting themselves to blood tests (Prelims, Quarters, Semis & finals) why can’t Manny do it 14 days before and shut everybody up. I rest my case
So Pedro, let me get this straight. Mosley was “cherry picked” by Mayweather and Clottey was “cherry picked” by Pac? I’m not asking about there past fights, I’m talking about these two particular fights.
let me disagree with you on pro#2. does floyd constantly make wt? he fought marquez 2lbs. heavier than the stipulated wt of 144lbs. he respects the sports of boxing? he can’t even respect the contract wt between him and marquez, so how can you expect an obdurate man to respect the sport where he applies his trade? how can you conclude he respects boxing when he evaded pacman by putting layers of ridiculous obstacles thereby denying boxing fans the fight they want to see? in his terrible fear of pacman, he even made boxing look like a joke when he hijacked the mantle of authority away from NSAC, by requiring fighters facing him to a bloodtest. so please think first before you publish your stupidity.
In fairness to floyd he is so good of a boxer south of welterwt.and i agree but i dont consider him an elite fighter today in this divison for the reason that he hasn’t fought any top welters.i will not discuss the character issue to make my point simple.floyd has yet to prove himself in this div.
ZDRX, #2 was in regards to his conditioning which is superb. Yeah he cheated by not coming in at weight against Marquez but thats the only fight I can remember that happening in and he was coming off an 18 month layoff to fight at 144 pounds, a weight he hadn’t fought at in years. So we agree that he cheated, but I think we can agree Mayweather always comes to his fights in shape. In regards to him respecting his sport I was referring to how he stays in shape…I was not referring to his attitude. What the hell does the drug test issue have to do with #2? If anything it backs my argument because that would mean he is trying to clean up the sport. I didn’t put it there as a positive for him because I don’t believe that he asked for drug testing for those aforementioned reasons. I think I addressed his attitude clearly in the Cons. If you would have read that part you wouldn’t have had to waste your time talking about the whole Pacman drug testing debacle which I never mentioned once in my piece.
Mosley no, Clottey yes!
@KP, How about the postponement of the Marquez fight? The rib injury? When FMJ was asked to produced the X-ray,FMJ says, he does not need to explain or show proof, but he wants to postpone the fight coz this things happen. Now if we comeback to your #2 regarding conditioning, Why then agree on specific date if you’re in good condition? FMJ postponed the fight, but eventually came 2 lbs. over the agreed weight fight, considering FMJ is fighting a smaller boxer.Or we can assumed that tickets sales then is not moving thats why the postponement. IN any case it just show that, I can make a mockery of any fighter, and the NSAC, what FMJ wants he gets..if
With all due respect, I don’t think that fighting either Mosley or Clottey can be called “cherry picking.” Clottey will loom over Pac. Heck, Pac looked small when he fought Morales at 130; he’s going to look like a munchkin fighting Clottey at 147. I’m not betting that Pac is going to win, but if he does, it will be a heroic feat.
Pbf’s greatest masterpiece was the Corrales fight. His most entertaining night may have been the Zab Judah incident. Both of those were some time ago. Pbf has been picking low-hanging fruit for an eternity it seems, so it’s good to see him test himself for once, even if Shane is getting long in the tooth. Here’s hoping that Shane doesn’t get old overnight.
Smart Filipinos know Floyd would befuddle Pac with speed. They try to belittle Floyd in an attempt to build up Pac. Get a life, your guy is good, but unless he beats Floyd, you cannot call him great!
Greatness is earned inside the ring against top fighters in your weight or above (not below). If you fight the best competition and win more times than you lose, you will probably be considered a great fighter; PLAIN AND SIMPLE! If Floyd beats Mosley, Pac and another top welter, there will be no more questions about his greatness. All Floyd has to do is beat the best at welter and noone can question him. The only question is, does he dare to be great? To Be Determined!
Clottey should have won against Cotto IMO and would have given Mosley fits if the two ever fought. I’ll agree to disagree with you on that one Pedro. Clottey is underrated if anything. Just like Manny Steward said, CLottey would be tough for ANYONE at Welters. When has anybody convincingly roughed up CLottey? Margo broke the compubox record of punches thrown winning against him, and Clottey still did not look beat up in that fight, even with a hurt hand! As much as I like Pac, I wouldn’t be upset if Clottey pulled the “upset”.
I agree with you though in regards to Pac fighting FLoyd and vice versa…they sort of need each other in regards to sealing themselves as great fighters, hands down…If Pac beats Clottey and SHane pulls the upset and beats mayweather, what would you say about Pac vs Mosley Pedro? Would that fight define him as great if Pac were to win?
Also at the time, there really wasn’t any Welter available that could be considered better than Clottey..The only one I see one could argue for is Bradley at 140…
“Argumentum ad hominim” Lets not talk more about the men but of the sports. MONEY PBF, PACMAN, MOSLEY OR CLOTTEY so much has been said about them. Come March 13 & May 1 I’ll buy my PPV to watch great fights! Clint Eastwood, Arnold Swarzanneger, Silvester Stallone and the like, don’t know them from a bar of soap but, I went to nearly all of their movies cos I GOT MY MONEY’S WORTH! And by the way Kev, thanks for letting me (and the whole world)know about his charity works. If this is true,cos I did’nt know, there you go folks. I’ve heard from Bob Arum and from realiable sources in the Philippines that Manny Pacquiao is a very generous person when it comes to charity and helping those in need. Let the boxers & fighters get into the ring but, boxing fans around the world, love em or hate em, put your PPV money where your mouth is. Otherwise, no money no honey and the sport of boxing will be dead (again).
Hei Kevin, Just wondering, how come PBF who after almost 2years of retirement, fought a lower-weight JMM got to become P4P #2? Is P4P Ring Magazine rankings SUPPOSED to be THE Bible of Boxing Rankings? I’m not a full-time boxing “afficionados” but hey, aren’t everybody else fought MORE and BETTER than PBF in those 2years PBF was retired? Give us some info here how do they (Ring Magazine) made their rankings? Maybe it’s just me, but some rantings out there I read in the net is that Ring Magazine=ODLH=GoldenBoyPromotions=PBF Promotions? Hmmmm, coincidence of hyping your own fighter?
slipjab73: “I didn’t think Cotto was going to be beat as bad as he was but I did expect him to be too slow for Pacquaio.”
I agree with you 100%. Before the fight with Pac, Cotto has been in tough battles even BEFORE the Margarita fight when he fought Torres,Judah, Mosley (siick fight!) But that Margarita fight was a beat down for sure. What I did not expect (like most boxing fans) was a beatdown of Cotto that Pac put on him. I also knew that Pac’s speed would be the undoing of Cotto. But to see the destroyer Cotto retreating by the 7th round agasinst Pac when it was already a forgone conclusion as to what would happen was nothing short of amazing.
Clottey on the other hand, is not washed up, and has never been seriously hurt where he has appeared in trouble as far as I can remember. He can handle speed, (beat down Zab Judah) and will most likely be the biggest and strongest foe that Pacquiao has faced. He is quite durable and stalks smaller opponants behind a tough to crack guard. I thought Clottey beat Cotto and had him retreating in the later rounds of their fight.
pedro,
same goes w/ pbf, u cannot call him great unless he beats “fighter of the decade” pacquiao…..wait, lets just say unless he beats pwill, which i think is the best WW today cause of his height & reach & non stop punching style. P Will is also young and hungry for recognition, pbf’s 40-0 is nothing, calzaghe retired undefeated so did rocky marciano
Yo 1200, rock, and kp bigups!!! Pbf is our generations Ali people hate him for his braggadocio they can’t take it. Better enjoy it while it’s here u may never see it again! I think that when pbf obliterates mosley PAC is gonna retire!!!! He don’t want nothing to do with money!!!!! And dencio pw hasn’t fought a welter fight for 2 years that means he isn’t a welter
Our generation’s Ali? Ali fought EVERYBODY; Ali was brave beyond belief; Ali would take huge punishment to win (or even to lose, e.g. against Frazier); Ali had the greatest willpower ever. And it was all to his detriment because in the end he took too much punishment.
PBF can’t even be mentioned in the same breath man!
Ali let a PRIME Foreman whale on him just because it was in his plan to win. Can you even begin to imagine the punching power of prime Foreman? In his prime the man lifted Frazier off the mat with his punches. That is beyond brave verging on suicidal.
Ali gets a pass for his bragging because he backed it up with guts and fighting everybody.
PBF is a different matter entirely.
In order for Pbf to equal Pac’s P4P accomplishments, he has to do some things he’ll never have the guts to do. Specifically, Pbf needs to move up to Super Middleweight and fight the best guys. That’s the equivalent of Pac going to Welterweight and fighting the best guys. In order to equal Pac’s heroic put-his-butt-on-the-line challenge of Josh Clottey, Pbf will have to risk his own butt by moving up to Supermiddle and challenging the likes of Edison Miranda. It’s a travesty when Pbf challenges little guys, old guys and washed-up guys and then allows nutsackhugging journalists to call him the P4P boss.
Warren , I agree PBF is no Ali, and I would hesitate to say he’s the best of our generation…he just hasn’t fought the opposition to deserve those types of accollades.
Whiner, I said he was the best pound for pound “boxer” the best fighter is Pacquaio. I hope you didn’t lump me into the nut sacking journalists that think Floyd is the best…I am not one of them.
“In order for Pbf to equal Pac’s P4P accomplishments, he has to do some things he’ll never have the guts to do. Specifically, Pbf needs to move up to Super Middleweight and fight the best guys. That’s the equivalent of Pac going to Welterweight and fighting the best guys.”
Pacquaio didn’t move up and face the best guys in his weight division especially WW. He beat a very predictable and sloppy Ricky Hatton, a weight drained DeLa Hoya and a shot and previously battered(1 too many wars) Miguel Cotto. Had Pacquiao walked into the division and fought Shane Mosely and beat him and Antonio Margarito, then such a statement could be valid. Mayweather moved up and fought the weight limits not catch weights like Pacquiao did. Freddy Roach picked opponents that he knew would have trouble making weight and or opponents whose track records favored Pacquaio. It’s a business so I’m not mad at Roach for doing that. I take nothing away form what Pacquaio has accomplished but don’t try to downplay Mayweather without being objective. If Mayweather defeats Mosely and moves up to 154 again and defeats the winner of the Cotto/Foreman fight or Cory Spinks and secures another title he will be the equivalent. Remember, Mayweather is still a 6 time world champion in 5 different weight divisions. If Mayweather beats Mosely then that would make him a 7 time world champion.
Tell em slip!!!!! A man can achieve greatness fighting in only one class ala marvalous mravin hagler!!! We will see hopefully when PAC and may get in the ring pbf is gonna make PAC look like a fool
mayweather is good, very good but nowhere near as good as he’s made out to be by some. not the greatest of all time that he claims by a long shot nor his generations best. he hasn’t fought all available comers and hasn’t been impressive against a lot of top guys he has fought. i give mosley a great chance in this fight. as for his personality, its fake, so i dont pay much attention to what he says.
Pac only fought Cotto at a weight limit of 145. Also he was an underdog versus De La Hoya, most predicted he would lose. Many gave Hatton a good chance of beating Pacman. It’s funny how people make excuses now that he destroyed all three when most thought they would be competitive matchups. If you are going to criticize Manny for making Cotto go down to 145 what about Floyd? he didn’t even make the 144 proposed weight for Marquez. So i think you need to be fair slipjab73. At least Manny didn’t chose to make a lightweight move up in weight to defend his title he is facing a legitimate welter in Clottey in his first defense. Let me ask you this. Did you predict Manny would win all three aforementioned fights? I did but I am assuming most thought he didn’t have a chance against De La Hoya…he didn’t just beat Oscar he destroyed him, so whether he was weight drained or not I don’t think Oscar would have beat him anyway. Excuses are excuses but the bottom line is none of those wins were even close and I feel he deserves some credit.
I agree with most of the posts about Mayweather. I will give you something to think about! Shane Mosley fought and beat Philip Holiday who was a descent champion at 135. I remember seeing Shane fight live in Connecticut on the undercard of Roy Jones and saying he would be a superstar and never be an undercard fight again. The question I will ask is this, when you look at Shane’s resume after he beat Oscar people were calling him p4p the best and he really only fought 3 world class fighters at the time, others were just c-fighters at best. He could have stayed on that road and ended up being in the same position as floyd, because let’s be honest, do you think Shane could beat anyone on Floyd’s resume (corley, brussles, gatti, mitchell, judah, baldomir, hatton & marquez). Now ask yourself this, how would Floyd do against Vernon Forrest & Winky Wright?? I’ll tell you, he would be undefeated!! The funny thing is I don’t dislike Floyd, I just don’t like people who con the game and that’s exactly what he has done, but fans have a lot to do with it ala Roy Jones in his prime…
Did you predict Manny would win all three aforementioned fights? I did but I am assuming most thought he didn’t have a chance against De La Hoya…he didn’t just beat Oscar he destroyed him, so whether he was weight drained or not I don’t think Oscar would have beat him anyway. Excuses are excuses but the bottom line is none of those wins were even close and I feel he deserves some credit.
If Cotto was such an elite candidate then why would Manny’s coach go on record and cleary say that Cotto was not the same fighter after the thrashing he took at the hands of Margarito and then ad the fact that Joshua Clottey battered him pretty bad as well. No human can take that type of punishment and it not affect them physically. Wo are you kidding here thinking that weight drain doesn’t affect a person’s ability to perform especially in boxing. Did you ever look at how out of it Roy Jones looked when he drained himself back down to light heavyweight from heavyweight. So weight drain does affect your energy systems which definitely affect your responsiveness and timing in a boxing match. No one is taking anythi away from Manny but the fact still remains that he didn’t walk into the WW division and take on the best. I hate to keep picking on Freddy Roach but even he stated that he would make Shane MOsely come down in weight to fight Manny because he wouldn’t give Mosely that type of advantage. That’s called strategic planning to beat your opponent before they ever walk into the ring. I can almost bet you that Mosely has a dialy walking around weight of 165-170 easy so dropping down past 147 is suicide. Let me ask you this since u pointed out Marquez, didn’t Manny move up from the same weight division? Had Marquez been somewhat competetive then would we be saying much other than Mayweather strugled against a smaller man. It wouldn’t have matter if Mayweather had been 2 pounds under the 144 lb limit, he would have had the same end result. Mayweather’s skill set is what beat Marquez not his size. Both fighter’s are counter punchers but one just happended to be more accurate and an overall better boxer.
slipjab73
just wait and see, margarito maybe next in line for pac, then mosley, after mosley ko pbf….and when pac beat these guys, are u ready to hail him as one of the greatest w/out any excuses? i didnt say GOAT, just one of the greatest…
K peezie ur killing me man!!!!! Ur a boxing man so I’m gonna ask u a ? Please give me an answer. When pbf amd PAC fight if somebody put a gun to ur head and said pic the winner who would u pick and why?
rios,
what if mosley beats pbf, does pac still need to prove himself against pbf or go on and face mosley instead? also slipjab73, when pac fought hoya,hatton,cotto the odds are 50-50, when pbf fought hoya & hatton, he was supposed to beat them, he is clearly the favorite, but who inflicted more damage to hoya & hatton?
kP… I definitely do not lump you in with the nustsackembracers. I think you are an objective guy and I like reading your material. Keep it up!
on top of obviously being on roids manny has had a career of handpicked opponents also come on barrerra morales past their primes obviously an kept on rematching those guys there was still joan guzman which they never mention an then there was humberto soto who wasna strong contender but he kept choosing all the older champions which at there age he had a great advantage in speed an hunger but he still couldnt beat marquez an a shot morales that lost to zahir raheem he has not fought no threats since his loss to morales shane mosely kept chasing freddie aint dumb he knows he cant beat him so they avoid him floyd is fighting a legetimate threat while freddie is hoping clottleys style which is to cover up most of the time will make pac man look good open your eyes boxing is about match making this guy has been perfectly matched since beating the okder past there prime mexicans on top of that he refuses to test! think about it i michael carbajal was on dat shit he coulda went up to junior welter knocking guys out
@ slipjab, Cotto was a 140 lb fighter a couple of years ago, he had to get down to 145 that is nothing i don’t care what anyone says. What Roy Jones did was weight drained himself almost 30 lbs. Dropping two pounds does nothing if your disciplined! It’s not like Cotto is over 6 feet tall or fought at any higher weight. Freddie Roach is suppose to give Pac confidence going into a fight, he has done it in the past as well, we just didn’t hear of it because of how large pac has gotten! I will say this, I don’t think pac can beat either Mosley or Mayweather, but we will see…
Mayweather should have 2 losses. He got whuipped by Castillo,every fan knows that . In the Judah fight he should have been disqualified for Roger entering the ring,but since steele and him are Vegas buddies that didn’t happen
what if mosley beats pbf, does pac still need to prove himself against pbf or go on and face mosley instead? also slipjab73, when pac fought hoya,hatton,cotto the odds are 50-50, when pbf fought hoya & hatton, he was supposed to beat them, he is clearly the favorite, but who inflicted more damage to hoya & hatton?
Mosley is the current champ so it would be the right thing to do for Manny to face him if he should beat Mayweather. It doesn’t matter how much damage you inflict on your opponent because at the end of the day a win is a win. Both Manny and Floyd have their own unique styles of beating opponents so damage is not the standard.
@LRG, I don’t understand how you can say Marco Antonio Barrera and Juan Marquez were past there primes when they fought Manny? Barrera was a top 5 p4p fighter and just beat Morales the year before he fought pac. Also he was 29 years old?? and hadn’t lost since the Morales fight in 2000, in which a lot of people thought he won! Marquez was 29 or 30 years old when he fought Pac and hadn’t lost in five years on a disputed decision. These guys got beat, period! There is no way you can say they were hand picked when they were the best around! These guys are hall of fame fighters in their prime! You don’t win and fight the guys that barrera and marquez have fought and not lose in five years, then when you lose have an excuse! It’s just like right now! I really don’t like Mayweather because i thought he handpicked guys for years, but if he beats Mosley, we have to take our hat off to him! You can’t say Mosley old after what he just did to Margarito!! Mayweather gets respect for beating an all-time great coming off an impressive win in his career…
Dencio pacman has nothing to prove he is an alltime great in my eyes. If he goes on a 50 fight loosing streak he still is bad.
lou, i agree with the first part of your post. i thought castillo beat fmj in their first fight and agreed with harold lederman’s card. he had it for castillo.
rios, i u consider being undefeated as a basis for GOAT, then i might say its calzaghe, more wins than floyd and better opponents. all the fighters that they say can beat him, calzaghe fought them, unlike pbf, if a fighter is a threat, ha has all the reasons not to fight him, “no following”, “too slow, i’ll beat him”, “he has no belt”, “he didnt call me out”, and the latest “should submit to random blood testing”. dont u find it funny that these excuses he made, are for all those fighters who maybe, just maybe has a chance of beating him
rios,
p will is willing to fight at WW, thats how good he is, multi division champ in the making….i might be wrong u know, but he has what it takes to be a multi division champ, height, reach, volume punching, also, he is not afraid to take on the best fighter out there…..so far.
how come cotto became a “battered fighter” after just one loss b4 pac? He is still young, and maybe in his prime, Ali was battered by frazier and was 32? b4 he fought a prime Foreman & look what he did to Foreman, I say cotto is a true warrior, he fought margarito, mosley, clottey & pac
Dencio u make valid points all around man. I think pbf should have taken some fights but I think it’s more a case of pesonal decisions. Not to line arums pocket ala Margarito cotto. Pw if he can go back down and get a title and beat all the guys around pbf should be able to force the fight but we shall see. And don’t get me started on SUPER joe calzage!!!!!! Soooo underated and underapriciated I think it’s all warens fault he keeps those guys in England tied up for years and waste thier talent!!!!! Joe was bad fast good reflexes heart stamina power ringsmarts beyond belief. I could go on all day with positives about super Joe. When have u ever seen b-hop trying to get out of a fight calzage had him totaly flustered crazy
Fellas: Look at the last 10 opponents pac fought vs. who Floyd fought. There is no comparison. That should tell you who fought the better competition in the last few years (Marquez twice, Barrera twice, Morales three times, Hatton, ODLH, Cotto). When Pac fought Diaz it was his first fight at 135, when he fought ODLH (he jumped up 2 weight classes) it was his first fight at 147, he then dropped down to 140 for Hatton and then at 145 for Cotto. Stepping up to fight bigger fighters and taking risks is what makes you great. fighting smaller fighters and fighters who you have a decided advantage don’t make you great (Baldomir, Gatti etc.). At 147 floyd has not proved himself yet. Floyd was great at 130 and 135, he still has a chance to be great at 147.
come on hes got hisays were all human but deep down inside i believe hes a good human being lol
rios,
so who do u think will win, a prime RJJ or a prime Calzaghe? i think its a good match-up if ever they fought in their prime.personally, i think RJJ would win.
i also thought the b-hop will inflict super joe’s first lost. after that fight, i became a believer, cause at first, i really doubt how good calzaghe was.
Smart latinos know Pacquiao is an all time great and they know Floyd is afraid to get beat up by Pacquiao.
by pac? floyd’s afraid to get beat up or lose to *anyone* and has been since he arguably lost to castillo back in 2002.
Don’t know dencio that would have been amazing. Yes Roy would have been faster but so would have calzage. Honestly I’d go with super Joe for the simple fact he has shown he could adapt. He did it with kelssler, jones, and b-hop I just think for some reason he would have found a way to win. But this is warrens fault we r speculating now. We will never know
Charity work?!?! How about paying your taxes like every other man……MONEY!
I see where Floyd has done some nice things in Vegas (for kids) but I saw no mention of his “Homeland” Grand Rapids Michigan. Has he forgotten where he came from or is there things in GR you failed to mention. I do not know and that is why I pose this question.. I take Mosley to win this bout (on strength) and mind-set,
although I do give Folyd a track-runners chance through 12…………………..
Mayweather lives in Vegas so I assume it makes moe sense to focus on the area where he and his children and family live in. Haven’t heard of any work he’s doing in Grand Rapids…probably hasn’t lived there for quite sometime. It’s possible he’;s done things in the past, but to my knoweldge currently he is focussing his charity work in Vegas.