DID FREDDIE ROACH REALLY SAY THAT?

December 18th, 2012 By Pedro Fernandez

“I’LL KISS MARQUEZ’S ASS IF HE COMES BACK CLEAN”

Time For Freddie Roach To Put Up?


COMMENTS

  1. Marquez was on PEDs, but he’ll test clean. That strength and conditioning coach has made a career out of concocting designer drugs that will beat the tests.

    tommyrenob on December 18th, 2012 at 5:39 AM
  2. Love it. The IRONY of everything in regards to drug/ testing.

    Love Pac as a BOXER but not the fake person outside the ring and in particular dislike the pactard fans.

    Marquez SHOULD retire in all the glory, he was thieved of the deserved praise/ money and family time… again and again over the years. He had to work his way back into contention and was always going to be the underdog. Not because Manny was better as an all round fighter, it was he had more natural attributes than Marquez. Hand / Foot Speed & Power. But never count out a clever boxer, that sucker line, brains before brawn.

    The 3rd fight was almost a perfect fight with a near perfect plan, but not surprisingly robbed again… This time round he took the biggest risk, opting for more power, in return hindering his speed (notably evident) which was already inferior in comparison to Manny. He took a massive risk, knowing the only way he could win was via a KO. I thought this was unrealistic, and he almost paid for it in the 4th round.

    Big props to Marquez, no matter what he does (except beat Mayweather, unrealistic..) he cannot top this. Don’t satisfy Manny just because you’re getting a massive payday. You have more than enough money and am sure will continue to make millions over the years whether it’s boxing related or not. Again, don’t satisfy Manny and his fans by taking a 5th fight, let them suffer with this defeat the way you endured the unfair decisions awarded to you over the years.

    Jaguar on December 18th, 2012 at 6:14 AM
  3. it’s very easy to NOT get caught. Anyone who who follows cycling knows how easy it is to avoid detection. Since the Armstrong affair cycling may be on it’s way to being clean. The tests in cycling now are very comprehensive, including lots of out of competition testing. Anyway it’s easy to pass the routine drug tests in boxing.

    Santa Cruz Jim on December 18th, 2012 at 8:41 AM
  4. Yeah he said it….lol…..Pedro why no article on memo dude has a past worth writing about funny you havent mentioned it yet!

    rio001 on December 18th, 2012 at 10:20 AM
  5. Marquez could easily give Mayweather a better fight the second time around now that he is accostumed to his new weight. Him coming up 17 lbs in weight to face Mayweather made him look slow like a weight drained Manny Pacquiao opponent. But personaly I think it would be the most boring fight like their last one. JMM should cash in on his new resurging fame along with his new body. Oh btw, if Manny Pacquiao came in bigger & stronger like Marquez and knocked his ass out, plus passed his PED test, I think the rumors would be running rampant if he had Angle H in his corner. It took Marquez at almost 40 to hit someone that hard. Yeah, he’s clean.. lol

    jlopez46 on December 18th, 2012 at 11:12 AM
  6. Never sir. Speed was the difference.

    Pedro Fernandez on December 18th, 2012 at 11:35 AM
  7. JLO46,

    You have a lot of reading to catch up on. Try doing so before you make a bigger fool of yourself.

    I just have 1 more gift to close out my X-mas shopping:
    Freddie Roach – Chap Stick

    OOOHHH!
    SKERGE

    SKERGE on December 18th, 2012 at 1:41 PM
  8. Doping aside, i thinks it’s pretty sad to watch all of Freddy’s fighters jumping ship. I think he is a hell of a trainer, these last few months have taken a toll on him.

    Ride on December 18th, 2012 at 2:36 PM
  9. Marquez has never tested positive for a banned substance and had never even been accused of using anything other than legal supplements and a heavy dose of hard work and technical training. now Team Punkuiao’s* “outrage” over being accused or even suspected of using illegal substances has been replaced by their desperate and hypocritical rush to accuse another fighter of using illegal substances (lol). nothing saintly, great, or “legendary” about Team Punkuiao*. simply promotional hype applied to a good fighter and designated cash-cow who in like in an old Hollywood plotline had been carefully protected with set-ups, began to believe his own hype, and is now experiencing the overdue challenges of competing against the best. meanwhile, Pucker-Up Freddie. Marquez’s commission-approved ass is ready to be kissed.

    El Coyote on December 18th, 2012 at 2:37 PM
  10. El Coyote: experiencing the overdue challenges of competing against the best huh?? i bet your ass wasnt saying “uhh..why is pacquiao fighting barerra…he needs to fight the best…” “uhh…whos marquez?? why is pacuiao fighting this guy??” “u mean hes fighting morales??why??”…

    1200 Techs on December 18th, 2012 at 5:27 PM
  11. @ El Coyote if Pacquaio has been protected with set ups I guess thats saying alot about the first three fights with Marquez….also the only person that even mentioned Marquez might be using something was Roach but after reading this interview http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/212-/62575394 Angel Memo gave who could blame him.Marquez landed a helluva punch two of them to be exact but if you associate with a guy like Memo expect the cloud of suspicion that goes along with it.By the way Pacquiao has never tested positive for a banned substance either but a few accused him because of his S & C coach as well……lol “and is now experiencing the overdue challenges of competing against the best” lol damn you act like this was his first fight against JMM or did you mean the new and improved JMM just curious?

    rio001 on December 19th, 2012 at 8:36 AM
  12. @rio001: That article is damning to say the least ( http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/212-/62575394). If I was JMM I would stay as far away from this guy as possible. Even if he is clean, he is going to be accused of being dirty by associating with Herdia (or whatever his name is today). If that was Pac, Pedro would have told us all to connect the dots. I like JMM, but I think he may have been more concerned about getting the W against Pac as he was for his legacy. It seems that he was so consumed with beating Pac that he didn’t mind tarnishing his image.

    Jrock09 on December 19th, 2012 at 2:30 PM
  13. if Pacquiao* agrees to OSTing for a fifth match v. Marquez, it becomes obvious that it was Floyd not “needles” that Punkuiao* was avoiding all along. what a F’n ride Pacquiao’s* fanboys have been taken for (lol). Team Punkuiao* actually relies on their stupid asses to cover his pussy-footing tracks. even now they can’t stop whining and crying over drug testing they were vouching for just a couple of weeks ago to defend Pacquiao’s* integrity(?!). meanwhile, Pacquiao* needs to earn that fifth match v. Marquez. he’s coming off of three consecutive losses and this last one was conclusive. it ranks right up there with Marciano v. Walcott, Hearns v. Duran, Martinez v. Williams, Pacquiao* v. Hatton, Rahman v. Lewis. in fact, considering the context, i don’t hesitate to rank Marquez’s demolition of Pacquiao* as the Greatest KO in Boxing history, which provides their rivalry with a worthy bookend to the Biggest Choke in Boxing History. also provided courtesy of Pacquiao’s* limited boxing skills.

    El Coyote on December 19th, 2012 at 3:06 PM
  14. facts are facts, again of all the hundreds, if not thousands of conditioning coaches you can hire, you hire a convicted steriod dealer who knows how to beat the drug tests and know when and how to cycle so you can beat the test? don’t marquez and company look at people’s resume or maybe that’s exactly what they did when they hired this guy, and another fact is nevada gives a piss test, big deal,unless it’s a blood test, that piss test is a joke these days…at 39 marquez look like he had the body of a 24 year old!!! ha ha ha

    Mario on December 19th, 2012 at 3:47 PM
  15. All the people talking how Marquez body is so drastically changed is making excuses! I’m in my mid 30′s and finished a round of insanity and got ripped! That’s doing in once a day for about an hour a day and not really paying attention to the nutritional guide. Marquez was working his ass off for 4 months hrs a day and eating right. Maybe you fatasses should try Marquez workout and be as dedicated as him and you will see that what he did isn’t that crazy you just need to be as dedicated as this dude was! Pow! Right in the kisser!

    TT on December 19th, 2012 at 5:13 PM
  16. @jaguar
    pac/jmm3 was not a robbery, it was a close fight that could go either way, and the judges saw pac as the winner. rios/abril is an example of a “robbery”.

    dondon on December 19th, 2012 at 10:20 PM
  17. Good post TT. Trouble is, many of the guys accusing JMM are out of shape slugs who never built muscle or sought greater strength or stamina. But it can be done especially by a PRO athlete who works for one goal…. Marquez entire life became beating Manny and he accomplished his goal… I have defended Pac against unfair, unproven PED accusations and I will do the same for Marquez because excellent performances don’t mean you are juicing… Manny got his brain jarred, and that can happen to ANY man if he is caught just right….No need to be bitter, the Pac Man express has been derailed possibly for good…It was a GREAT ride, but as of now its over he was facedown against a fellow GREAT fighter who was 39, it was NOT a good look.

    MB on December 20th, 2012 at 1:04 AM
  18. @TT if you read the link you will see that just because you take a PED doesnt mean you sit back and eat donuts and watch tv and all the sudden you are superman.No you have to work just as hard and nobody in their right mind can question JMM’s work ethic so your point is meaningless…by the way congrats on your new physique.

    @El Coyote if your saying Pacquiao has limited boxing skills then your saying
    Marquez is not so great and to that I would have to quote one of the Mayweathers
    “YOU DONT KNOW S**T ABOUT BOXING”…you mention Pacquiao if he agrees to “OST”(olympic style testing) well tell us genius when is Marquez going to start?8 weeks before the fight ? You do realize “OST” is 365 24/7 dont you? lol proably not you proably believe Floyd does “OST” as well…lol …sorry only Nonito Donaire does “OST”.How can you say he choked he was knocked out.

    Rio001 on December 20th, 2012 at 8:37 AM
  19. El Coyote: Your style of writing reaks of another poster that has to change his NAME Memo style just to get on these boards for adamantly defending plastirito and any other mexican but on the other side of his mouth wants to yap about pacquiao…

    If I have u pegged right as that poster,
    like Pedro says, the sounds of a mouse pissing on a wad of cotton can be heard when anything negative is said regarding others of mexican decent from u…

    say it aint so??

    1200 Techs on December 20th, 2012 at 10:39 AM
  20. Heredia’s a genius and worth every penny. his training-regimen provided Marquez with that extra jolt, which enabled him to carry the potency of his lightweight TNT to “welter”. at this point, Pacquiao’s* old news. Marquez needs to go for Bradley and if Pacquiao* has finally snapped out of his losing streak by then, Marquez may fight him in Mexico City, guarantee Pacquiao* a flat fee, and both fighters submit to OSTing protocol. Take-It or Leave-It. Marquez just destroyed Pacquiao*. he doesn’t need Manny* any more than Martinez needed Williams after their rematch. the rivalry is OVER.

    El_Coyote on December 20th, 2012 at 2:47 PM
  21. @Rio001 My point is valid as can be! People are dismissing this victory saying how strong and ripped Marquez looked and how it was so impossible for him to look like that at damn near 40 yrs old which is not the case. I’ve never felt Marquez power you have never felt Marquez power but Pac has and he himself said he seen no difference in his power. I tend to believe him! He got caught with a perfect punch. It happens! By the way thanks for the compliment.

    TT on December 20th, 2012 at 5:31 PM
  22. @TT I can understand what your saying on that power issue on one hand.. but in reality Manny cant complain about anything because he never wanted to submit to testing either.You say people are dismissing his victory and I am sure there are some Pac fanatics that are… and then there are the others like myself who are suspicious because of Herida. People are gonna be suspicious and Marquez should have known that I mean lets be real if you started training with a guy who says he has 20 undetecable steriods and after 3 fights with the same guy who you never knocked down not once in 3 close contested fights.Now you knock him down with one shot and then put his lights out with another people well at least some are gonna wonder.I believe Marquez trained his ass for this fight and I am sure he trained hard for the previous ones as well I would never question that dude’s work ethic trust me….but if a dude is willing to drink his own piss (during training for Mayweather fight) its hard for me not to believe he would not do what ever it takes to get a decisive win.It seems since Mayweather settled his lawsuit with Manny people in the media are a little hesitant to say the wrong thing for fear of a lawsuit….and my compliment on your physical transformation was sincere I am 41 and I know that it is not easy to do!

    rio001 on December 20th, 2012 at 8:11 PM
  23. El Coyote: Ur silence is defeaning…u R that guy huh?? lol..when other people are labled cheaters you’re one of the most vocals yet not one mexi Can’t do wrong in your eyes huh? what a joke…this guy defended margacheato tooth and nail for years and wouldn’t believe marquez did anything wrong if he was asked to shoot marquez ass with steriods…who needs freddy to kiss marquez’s ass when el coyote is just how how howling to do it!!

    1200 Techs on December 21st, 2012 at 10:38 AM
  24. I respect Freddie Roach… To the point where I even dismiss his turning a blind eye due to his own fighters… And saying all the politically correct stuff… And as for my own personal opinion, I don’t think Marquez was clean for this last fight… But if Freddie said THAT about Marquez, following his run with Pacquiao… Freddie needs to make good on his word kiss JMM’s bare ASS.

    Jack Dunne on December 21st, 2012 at 9:03 PM
  25. it appears that a startling dose of stark reality still isn’t enough to jolt some posters into sobriety. Pacquiao* was a promotional illusion who was a good fighter but only “great” when the matchmaking was great in his favor. as it always was from the moment he became Arum’s designated cash-cow. in fact, only the most clueless fight-fan or Pacquiao* zealot would vouch for the pristine profile of any Arum fighter. Wake-Up! the curtain’s have been pulled. the old man exposed. Pacquiao’s* accomplishments are no more real than the Wizard of Oz. too bad that the line for brains is permanently closed.

    El Coyote on December 22nd, 2012 at 1:58 AM
  26. @ Jack Freddie never said that in the above headline he said”If he is natural he would kiss his ass”…Pedro was just doing a little bending of the truth!! And you can say what you want but you know the truth and the truth is the Nevada drug test aint catching none of the top notch S&C guys …..I am sure Mr Conte will agree that!

    rio001 on December 22nd, 2012 at 10:38 PM
  27. @rio… Thanks for the clarification… It didn’t sound like something Roach would say, but I stopped being shocked by ANYTHING re the world of PED’s a long time ago so I guess it is accurate to say, I got hooked.

    You are dead on correct with your next statement. In fact, about the only way TO get caught by existing testing practices is for the person using to be careless or sloppy… And actually, I have heard Conte speak about this before, from what I gather, he doesn’t think you even have to be ‘top notch’ to beat the system. To hear him speak, most 15 year-old boys could pull it off.

    Jack Dunne on December 23rd, 2012 at 9:31 AM
  28. El Coyote: you said ” in fact, only the most clueless fight-fan or Pacquiao* zealot would vouch for the pristine profile of any Arum fighter.”

    so why the hell did you back margacheats the whole time?? lol…
    still cant answer that huh?

    if thats true, then do u also put an asterisk next to marga cheato, marquez, rios, salido??

    1200 Techs on December 24th, 2012 at 12:46 PM
  29. Jack,

    Why do you think JMM was on something? Do yo think Pac was always clean?

    SKERGE

    SKERGE on December 26th, 2012 at 10:15 AM
  30. beyond photo-ops and talk-show appearances, Pacquiao* has only been dividing his attention between bible-thumping and Boxing. besides, even in his promotional prime, Pacquiao* was a lazy, easily-distracted, gambling, womanizing, carousing, and one-dimensional puncher guided by a trainer who has only ever produced one-dimensional (albeit ready-made) punchers NOT versatile or adaptable boxers. of course, i’ve been trying to explain this to You for two weeks now. bottomline, Marquez’s legacy-defining win had EVERYthing to do with Marquez’s prepration, ring-smarts, and execution and NOTHING to do with ANYthing Pacquiao* did or didn’t do. Marquez Is and has always been Greater.

    El Coyote on December 28th, 2012 at 5:56 PM
  31. SKERGE,

    If you still haven’t figured the world of professional athletics out by NOW… God Bless you my friend…

    Jack Dunne on December 29th, 2012 at 8:41 PM
  32. El Coyote: Wow you fail at explaining like you fail to answer my questions! Lol…Paquiao lazy huh? ahaha… lol..i want to see u do one of his workouts!…whats so funny is as much as you bash pacquiao, you probably didnt pay attention to your idol Marquez who shook pacquiaos hand and said after their 4th fight ” Your a great, GREAT fighter!” Face the facts..ur stupid asterisks who you cant even apply to known “cheaters” from your own country fall short from discrediting the record pacquiao has built…

    1200 Techs on December 30th, 2012 at 6:00 AM
  33. Pacquiao* is the only fighter to ever reject harmless OSTing and a $25-$50 million payday to face his primary P4P rival. Marquez and Mayweather welcome it. Manny* is the only suspect Mfr in this equation. bottomline, Marquez was no more cleaner or “dirtier” than Pacquiao* was when he planted him face-first and butts-up into the ring canvas. Rivalry OVER.

    El_Coyote on December 31st, 2012 at 12:02 AM
  34. Jack,

    Why so rude? I’m merely wanting to see what your rationale is/was. Of course I’ve figured it out, I just can’t recall if you defended Manny when Floyd made his accusations, so I just want some clarification. Is this about the Glen Beck crack? Don’t be so high-strung, relax.

    SKERGE

    SKERGE on December 31st, 2012 at 5:05 PM
  35. El Coyote: You must have not gotten the “MEMO” it doesnt MATTER regarding that fake osdt testing to begin with, since there are MANY concoctions that can be made, specifically by someone like Heredia himself, that CANNOT be detected! You put an asterisk on Pac. based on “suspecion”, where’s the one for Marquez then huh?? and what about ur boy margacheato who got caught plasterhanded?? u are the same guy bashing cotto and pumping up in ur words “Wargarito” right? lol…what a joke

    1200 Techs on January 3rd, 2013 at 12:39 PM
  36. Marquez and Marquez alone is responsible for the Nine (9) Year rivalry that Team Pacquiao* always wished and prayed would just go away. instead, Marquez literally stalked Pacquiao* all the way from bantamweight to catchwelter; unifying lightweight along the way by defeating the same fighters that Punkuiao* leap-frogged; challenging and facing Mayweather FIRST; and finally KOing Manny* in such decisive fashion that it exceeded anybody’s imagination or nightmare. Pacquiao’s* fanboys are simply hoping that father time FInally does catch-up to Marquez, which was the primary reason Team Pacquiao* agreed to face Marquez a 2nd, 3rd, and Final time. what would prove that it wasn’t a fluke is Marquez also KOing the man who “officially” defeated Manny*, which is no less “official” than Manny’s* two “official wins” v. Marquez. otherwise, Marquez’ performance only improved in each bout v. Pacquiao* and he can’t possibly improve on the final result. in fact, taken together, the unofficial result of III and the devastating result of IV already confirms Marquez’s irrefutable boxing and punching dominance over Pacquiao*. Mission Accomplished. the rivalry is OVER. Viva Marquez!

    El Coyote on January 3rd, 2013 at 6:49 PM
  37. @el coyote
    rivalry over? yes and pac lead their head to head 2-1-1. You can argue the result of the first three fight, but those are close fight that could go either way, not a robbery, which makes it legit and official.

    dondon on January 5th, 2013 at 3:58 AM
  38. El Coyote: “Marquez literally stalked Pacquiao* all the way from bantamweight to catchwelter; unifying lightweight along the way by defeating the same fighters that Punkuiao* leap-frogged;”

    Give a fool enough rope and he hangs himself! lol

    So a featherweight was chasing an imaginary bantamweight (pac skipped 118)?? you are such a FOOL when it comes to Manny Pacquiao that your sight is as good Margaritos right eye after pac busted it…

    After that bs statement, the rest of your words are worthless…

    I pulled your card when I spotted your bs style of writing even though you changed your name “MEMO” style to get on here after your ass got bounced out of here a long time ago.You are KNOWN to be blinded by nationalism so you fall under the catagory of them pacnuts and others who carry their flag up thier arse while ranting and raving. Tell me Im not right??

    1200 Techs on January 5th, 2013 at 12:58 PM
  39. SKERGE… My “rational” is the same reality you use when walking down a dark street when a gang of thugs is approaching… I don’t need to be put into the hospital in the name of “objectivity”… When it comes to PED’s. On this note; too many people do.

    If I had ANYTHING left in the reservoir before the Lance Armstrong scandal; what little I did have was GONE after that… Athletes Cheat, Lie, PED and do whatever it it takes and they do it because the Fame, Money and Perks are too great a temptation.

    Maybe not ALL of them… But probably damn near all of whom “matter”… And those aren’t my words. Those are the words of a strength and conditioning coach to world champions whom told me as much about a decade ago.

    I have no idea where the Glenn beck comment comes from… And in the name of God, this is not an invitation for you to elaborate… PLEASE attempt to stay on topic.

    Jack Dunne on January 5th, 2013 at 5:08 PM
  40. SKERGE…

    My beliefs about Manny are WELL documented here. I am arguably the biggest Manny accuser on this board. So big that Pedro has edited my comments and made note of it right after the fact.

    I don’t believe May is clean either. I don’t believe that ANY athlete who performs at the level they do, with the inadequate level of PED testing they are subject to (which is nothing short of a JOKE) is clean… Not a ONE!

    … Not a ONE that ‘Matters’ anyway.

    Jack Dunne on January 5th, 2013 at 7:22 PM
  41. it was inevitable that Pacquiao’s* promotional “greatness” could no longer be sustained beyond the soft touches or cherrypicked and further compromised Names that are the foundation of his “greatness”. otherwise, he remains in his physical prime and is a very good fighter who was executing everything he wanted to do v. Marquez but Marquez is better and greater, which he Proved with his DEVASTATING and rivalry-ending KO win. otherwise, without the great matchmaking, Pacquiao* is only a very good fighter.

    El Coyote on January 7th, 2013 at 4:29 PM
  42. This el coyote is funny…lol for a while I thought you were serious now I see is that you have weird sense of humor thats all…lol….the “Marquez is better and greater” line is classic….your doing a boxing writer parody correct?…lol great stuff!

    rio001 on January 8th, 2013 at 9:48 AM
  43. Mayweather humiliated and defeated Ortiz; faced DLH fresh off of his impressive KO of Mayorga withOUT a catchweight; DOMinated Marquez; defeated and KO’d Hatton FIRST; DOMinated Shane FIRST; defeated Cotto withOUT a catchweight; agreed to an unprecedented $1 million overweight clause only to be rebuffed by Team Punkuiao* for requesting Harmless, Random, and MUTUALLY-Applied blood and urine testing. Mayweather has firmly controlled the moral high-ground throughout this shameful saga. Pacquiao’s* shameless fanboys might as well sling snowballs at the sun. Pacquiao* is a carefully-managed, desperately protected, promotional hype-job that has been thoroughly exposed by the glare of Mayweather’s and Marquez’s authentic greatness.

    El Coyote on January 8th, 2013 at 4:57 PM
  44. rio001…I don’t think he’s kidding…

    if he’s the guy I’m thinking off, well, here’s an example of his posts from the past here on RingTalk from 2009…

    “it seems like the two people who should be Most pissed at Margarito, simply refuse to condemn him(?). IMO, it’s either an endorsement of Margarito’s integrity(?) or insecurity regarding their own(?). come to think of it, i haven’t read much from ANY fighters on this issue.(?). it’s an intriguing pattern that seems to be developing among those presumably placed at most risk by the alleged actions of Team Margarito . . .”

    “meanwhile and IMO, what remains a glaring omission in Cotto’s reluctance to condemn Margarito is a declaration regarding his corner’s competence to detect any shady practices while observing an opponent’s handwrapping from beginning to end? the NSAC has already testified to that effect. why doesn’t Cotto simply echo their statement and at least put That part of this controversy to rest? ”

    Fastforward to 2012…same guy (if I’m correct) calling on Wargarito to pummel Cotto…viva mexico, and yada yada from this guy..but in the end…done in the voice of Eddie Murphy, the “No spoon bit” in the last scene of the movie Coming to America…”no asterisk!” for Margarito from El Coyote*! lol…

    *if I’m correct

    1200 Techs on January 8th, 2013 at 9:09 PM
  45. sorry..meant 2011

    1200 Techs on January 8th, 2013 at 9:13 PM
  46. Those comments I pulled are from after the shellacking of Margarito by Mosley and Margacheato got suspended for a year…This guy* defended Margarito tooth and nail…

    *if I’m correct

    1200 Techs on January 8th, 2013 at 9:21 PM
  47. @el coyote

    So, pac cherrypicked a “better & greater Marquez” 4 times???

    dondon on January 9th, 2013 at 2:32 AM
  48. Coyote, I think you are taking it to the extreme here. Whether or not you think he was favored in any of the bouts you mentioned, Manny had to beat those guys and did so decisively. In my opinion the Cotto bout with Mayweather wasn’t such a great feat from a weight standpoint. Cotto is not a 154lb fighter by any stretch and the fighters he beat at the weight tell the story. As for catch weights, people fail to bring up that in Manny’s fight against Marquez, Manny had a catchweight to appease Marquez when he didn’t have to do so. Mayweather faced Marquez at an unnatural weight and failed to meet the stipulation. Yeah Marquez got more money but it wasn’t an even playing ground. The fight against De La Hoya from what I remember it was Oscar who requested a catchweight because he was so convinced he beat Manny. The only way to get a fight with Manny was to fight at 147 because Manny’s fight before that was at 135lbs. As for oscar weighing 145, that was his own doing. I hate it when people try to be keyboard messengers when in reality no one cried about these fights before they happened. Only after he beat those guys people tried to use weight as an issue. Both guys can be accused of getting unfair advantages over foes. Bottom line here is it doesn’t really matter because in the end all that really matters is who won the fights. The only real farce in my mind was the bout with Margarito for a 154lb belt fought at 150. Everything else you’ve mentioned is just sour grapes and I can guarantee you weren’t tooting your horn until after the fact. Most though Oscar would destroy Pacman.

    Kevin Perry on January 9th, 2013 at 11:05 AM
  49. as far as i’m concerned, Marquez DID clearly defeat Pacquiao* every time they fought and that is not only my opinion. unfortunately, too many fanboys and Arum judges were dazzled by the spectacle of KDs rather than the technical brilliance of Marquez’s sweet science. the same difference between checkers and chess. some here are obviously checkers fans. fortunately, the memory/nightmare of IV is the “clearest” outcome possible and has not only ENDED their rivalry but also Pacquiao’s* run at the top. the win v. Barrera was legit. although, there were legitimate and well-publicized pre-fight distractions that affected Barrera’s performance the costliest one was Barrera’s fault. he (along with EVERYone else) underestimated the unknown Pacquiao*. however, Barrera also went on to defeat the same Morales that subsequently and convincingly defeated Pacquiao*. “ODH”? really? the guy who was compelled to weigh-in at 145lbs from this established 145lbs and reportedly not allowed to weigh-in over 147lbs on fight-night? DLH also made the costly mistake of underestimating a very good and dangerous fighter in Pacquiao*. Ricky Hatton? ANYbody who was counting on Hatton’s chin to prevail v. Pacquiao* was delusional. in fact, Team Pacquiao* was counting on Hatton’s fatally-flawed chin for the opposite outcome.

    even during his “glorious” prime, Pacquiao* was a gambling, womanizing, cock-fighting, and easily-distracted fighter. the primary difference is that Marquez continues to adapt and improve the execution of his fight-plan while Pacquiao* remains the same single-fisted, one-dimensional, and predictable puncher he’s always been. in fact, the most noteworthy element of Pacquiao’s* performance in this bout is the absence of any post-loss excuses. Team Punkuiao* has literally run out of them. now the shills, hacks, and fanboys will have to rely on themselves and themselves alone to salvage Pacquiao’s* credibility, at the price of their own.

    El Coyote on January 9th, 2013 at 4:54 PM
  50. El Coyote: You love fairytales…. please tell us that one u told how the great marquez chased pacquiao since bantamweights literally!..lol….

    1200 Techs on January 9th, 2013 at 5:19 PM
  51. El Coyote: So who exactly was Marquez’s best wins WITHOUT pacquaio?? and dont tell me Juan diaz unless u wanna get laughed at!

    1200 Techs on January 9th, 2013 at 5:41 PM
  52. Marquez either targets Bradley or retires. he’s got NOTHING more to prove or improve v. Pacquiao*. in fact, considering how Marquez’s performance improves with each fight, Pacquiao* is risking permanent damage (or worse) in a 5th encounter v. Marquez. the rivalry is OVER. Viva Marquez!

    El_Coyote on January 10th, 2013 at 2:06 PM
  53. El Coyote: so it’s pretty safe to assume since u didnt deny I have you spotted as THAT poster…just curious, how come no asterisks for mexicans like margarito, rios, salido, etc??

    1200 Techs on January 11th, 2013 at 4:14 PM
  54. after 10 years under Roach’s tutelage, Pacquiao* still doesn’t possess a consistent jab, right-hook (i.e., “Manila Ice”), or body-attack. if Canelo actually does confirm a bout v. Mayweather, Manny’s* best bet is to target Guerrero and test his claim to welter prominence. otherwise, Pacquiao* should rest, recover, and allow the dust to settle before confirming a bout in September. during which i hope that Marquez targets Bradley for the double-exclamation point to his supremacy over Manny* and retirement. there is absolutely nothing Marquez can possibly do to improve on his recent “W” over Manny. a 5th match would be nothing but a generous courtesy to Manny* which he made Marquez compete, sacrifice, and practically beg for. IMO, Rios and Guerrero will still be around to close the book on Pacquiao’s* career.

    El_Coyote on January 14th, 2013 at 10:03 PM
  55. El Coyote: you said “Barrera was legit. although, there were legitimate and well-publicized pre-fight distractions that affected Barrera’s performance the costliest one was Barrera’s fault. he (along with EVERYone else) underestimated the unknown Pacquiao*.

    So you agree that fight was LEGIT right? (even though you want to refer to EXCUSES right after…)

    but look at before when you call Pacquiao “promotional hype-job that has been thoroughly exposed by the glare of Mayweather’s and Marquez’s authentic greatness.”

    Do explain how an EX LINEAL FLYWEIGHT champion is a hype-job, when he bombed on top 3 p4p at the time in Barera? In your words, “the win v. Barrera was legit.”

    Do explain how a hype job still has what it takes to tango with the best around his weight class, CONSIDERING how much RING MILAGE he has, always taking on big dangerous fights and being pretty damn old at 34 considering how small he is.

    Do explain how somebody all hype, would give the shellacking to Cotto in his SECOND fight as a welter that Pac did.

    There’s different STYLES of fighters. You might give more credit to others that have a beautiful left hook like Donaire or Danny Garcia, or somebody that has great ring generalship like Hopkins or Ward. But what you cannot deny is Pacquiao had the DEADLIEST 1 twos and a heart to match willing to walk through hell in his PRIME. In fact, many good fighters wilted against pac’s “predictable” 1 twos. El Coyote, seek help. Im affraid you simply suffer is revisionest history complexity from drinking to much HATERADE!

    1200 Techs on January 16th, 2013 at 11:39 PM
  56. if these threads are any indication, Pacquiao’s* fanbase is dwindling. “poor” 1200 has had to assume double-duty in the last half of this thread to make up for the sudden absence of the biggest Pactard of them all, rio001, and Manny’s* most devout “expert” worshiper, dondon. rio is still dropping in space waiting to hit bottom and dondon is experiencing sudden memory loss like Tony Soprano’s mom “Livia” from the Sopranos. Marquez’s rivalry-ending KO victory could not be more complete . . . Viva Marquez!

    El_Coyote on January 17th, 2013 at 11:08 PM
  57. Marquez v. Bradley, Mathysse, Garcia, Khan, Rios, or even Alvarado would sell-out in L.A., Vegas, or Mexico. those matchups aren’t DLH v. Forbes or Mayweather v. Bruseles we’re talking about (Who the f’k watched That fight?). these are intriguing matchups where it’s not a given that Marquez will KTFO of his opponent, which is the case v. Pacquiao*. not unlike Martinez v. Williams, Marquez has Pacquiao* clocked and timed and now has the right caliber ammo to Deck Manny* each and every time he lands flush. a skill he’s demonstrated throughout their sustained rivalry. age is the only real factor that can shift momentum in Pacquiao’s* favor. in fact, it’s the primary reason Team Pacquiao* ever agreed to II and III four years apart and the primary reason they agreed to rematch in the fateful IV is 1) the superiority Marquez demonstrated in III and 2) Pacquiao* cannot headline a PPV fight v. B or B+ opponents, e.g., Pacquiao* v. Garcia isn’t a PPV event. at best it’s an undercard to Marquez v. Bradley. Get It?

    El_Coyote on January 17th, 2013 at 11:09 PM
  58. I’m a HUGE marquez fan so i agree those fights you mentioned would sell out. So tell me genius, u dont think pac would sell those same fights out in L.A.?

    Your revisionist history complexity is kicking in regarding the rematch. You must have forgot when marquez didn’t immediately want to take a rematch cause he didn’t think he was getting paid correctly, and like when I call u genius, (i’m being ingenious of course), Marquez did the most genius move of them all to fight Chris John in Indonesia for (in dr. evils voice) “30 thousand dollars!”

    Anybody else wanna handle this guy coyote, who I’m sure changed his name memo style to get back on here??

    1200 Techs on January 18th, 2013 at 8:04 AM
  59. Pac cant headline a ppv fight…thats funny…bradley is far from a draw…those num. didnt exactly do to bad now did it??

    1200 Techs on January 18th, 2013 at 9:48 AM
  60. Your obviously a Mayweather fan (so am I btw) but lets be real…if he fights Guerrero this may, do you really think he can pull bradley pac numbers WITHOUT Canelo??

    1200 Techs on January 18th, 2013 at 9:50 AM
  61. Mr. el_coyote,

    memory loss?? after pac vs jmm 1, team pacquiao wanted an immediate rematch, and what did team jmm did? they settle for less $$ and chose chris john. And guess what, pac vs jmm 5 is in the works, rivalry is not just over yet.

    dondon on January 18th, 2013 at 8:57 PM

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