CAN MOSLEY UTILIZE SIZE TO BEAT MAYWEATHER?
April 29th, 2010 By Jarrad Woods
MEGA-BOUT NOW JUST TWO DAYS AWAY!
New York, NY- Saturday’s welterweight (147 lb) match up between the Ring magazine’s #2 and #3 pound for pound fighters, Shane Mosley (46-5 39 KOs) and Floyd Mayweather (40-0 25 KOs) will answer many questions for the boxing purist and the armchair fan alike. Mainly, whether or not Floyd is as good as he believes he is. If Mayweather beats Mosley, particularly in a dominating fashion, who can still claim that Floyd’s skills have not been tested?
DOES FLOYD AVOID/DUCK ‘SIZABLE’ FOES?
When most detractors speak disparagingly about Floyd Mayweather today, many of them say that he has yet to face an elite welterweight.
This is underlined by the assumption that Floyd is a ‘cherry picker’ and is avoiding the toughest challenges, particularly in his own division. The truth is, Floyd did face Oscar De La Hoya at jr. middleweight (154 lbs), a division higher than welterweight, resulting in Floyd’s only split decision victory. But is size the difference between Floyd winning or losing or is it simply business that has kept some fights from happening?
ODDSMAKERS SAY SIZE IS NOT AN ISSUE
Given that Mosley will be the perceived bigger man in this bout, it’s strange that the odds-makers are currently showing Mayweather as a 4-1 favorite over his seemingly toughest opponent. According to Emanuel Steward, most of his HBO colleagues, including Jim Lampley, Harold Letterman and Larry Merchant have Floyd winning the bout. The truth is Mosley is much more of a long shot to win because he simply doesn’t look great against technical boxers.
OSCAR FIGHTS WERE ‘TECHNICAL WINS’ FOR SHANE
The closest Mosley came to defeating a prime technical boxer were his victories over De La Hoya in 2000 and 2003. Mosley did beat Oscar De La Hoya, but is also important to note that (at the time) he was also using steroids and both victories were disputed. A drug free Mosley certainly wouldn’t have been expected to do better against a prime De La Hoya, so it’s makes you wonder about the edge the steroids actually gave him in those wins. Mosley has looked excellent against stationary fighters who come forward and brawl, because he has a great chin and usually possesses the faster hands. However, Miguel Cotto (5’6”) proved, skill and ring generalship and not size was the real deciding factor when he outpointed Mosley in 2007.
WAS COTTO THE BIGGEST MISS FOR FLOYD?
For reasons that I still cannot understand, Floyd never fought Miguel Cotto. Cotto was the one welterweight fighter who literally was able to fight everyone of significance at welterweight not named Mayweather. Many would say that it’s Arum’s fault, that Cotto was too green, never called Floyd out, or the money wasn’t there for Floyd, etc. but I believe it was a much needed fight, particularly when Cotto was undefeated and in his prime. It’s a shame, not because I believe Floyd would have had much trouble, but because he never took the opportunity to assert his dominance against the best the sport had to offer. If there is one strike I have against Floyd its not facing Cotto in his prime.
WHAT ADVANTAGES DOES SHANE HAVE?
Mosley beat the guy that beat the guy. Antonio Margarito destroyed Cotto in eleven rounds, making him the best welterweight in 2008. Because Mosley lost to Cotto but then beat the snot out of Margarito, we can really say that styles make fights. Although Margarito is a polar opposite to Mayweather, there is still intrigue because Floyd has not faced many of the bigger threats at welterweight and Mosley also possesses comparable speed. But while these assets look good on paper, they don’t necessarily spell W-I-N for Mosley, considering what he’s up against. In this fight, Mosley will have to rely on another advantage that might count, and that is luck.
Jarrad Woods
Well, let’s see, went to welterweight in 2006 and never fought a single elite welterweight like ever. At least he’s finally stepping in with a real welterweight even if Shane’s almost 40 years old and his prime happened 10 years ago.
Anyway he’s only stepping in there with Shane because all-time great Pacquiao took on yet another top welterweight in Clottey, and it would look too bad to fight another little fat old guy like Marquez. Dude’s fighting Shane just because he was backed into a corner.
Shane’s still gonna whup his @$$ anyway. Too much heart. I can see maywetaher quitting on his stool or doing some other maligned behaviour to avoid getting stopped by Mosley.
Never saw a guy in all boxing history that fooled so many people into thinking he was a great fighter especially with avoiding basically all the toughest fighters of his era. He’s a good boxer, he’s not a great fighter.
Could be compared to Michael Nunn, good slick boxer and good enough to be a champion which deserves respect, but not a great fighter.
At least for me size and power don`t mean much in this fight for Mosely. Can he keep up a good work rate and stay active the whole fight, now thats what I think is gonna be the deal breaker one way or the other. Mosely needs to be able to keep that gas pedal to the floor all night, and when I say that I mean not just throwing punches recklessly, he needs to be ON all night. If he wants a chance to beat Floyd he needs to control the distance and tempo of this fight, the slower this fight gets Floyd will eat him alive. Styles make fights and theres a big differance between Floyd and Cotto/Margorito. Floyd by UD: Kind of a let down type of fight with afew good rounds or minutes of action here and there.
Pu**y Boy Floyd will run and run in this fight. He most likely will win by a UD. Im hoping Shane can shut his mouth but I’d rather see Pacquiao vs Mayweather in the late 2010.
>>Mosley did beat Oscar De La Hoya, but is also important to note that (at the time) he was also using steroids and both victories were disputed.
I agree the second fight was disputed but the first fight was a Mosley victory hands down.
I know there is strong evidence that Mosley was on steroids for the second fight but is there any evidence he was using them during the timeframe of the first ODLH fight? If so, they sure did not help him in the two Forrest fights which occurred after.
As for Shane’s record, he could easily only have two defeats on his record if he had not had immediate rematches with fighters that had his number–Wright and Forrest. That would be like Frazier seeking immediate rematches against Foreman. And I think Shane beat Cotto. Then again, I think he lost the second ODLH fight so maybe he could easily have only 3 defeats.
As for Floyd, I think he lost the first Castillo fight (punch stats show Castillo landed more punches) and the second fight was a draw in my eye.
I think this fight is definitely worth the PPV money but I’m out of town at a fraternity reunion so will avoid the media and watch the HBO replay a week later.
Shane’s not that much bigger. He’s a strong, full fledged Weltherweight, where as Floyd is a little bit less than that. However, as with Camacho & Delahoya, when a long limbed, athletically proportioned 19 year old turns pro at 130, you know that he will eventually be AT LEAST a Jr. Welther and probably vialble at 14&… which is exactly what happened.
If Floyd loses he absolutely can;t use the “I’m not a Weltherweight” excuse. The fact he couldn’t make even 144 vs. Marquez takes removes this argument forever.
Shane does have more experience with fighting much larger opponents than Floyd – but since they’re facing EACH OTHER, that experience won’t come into play on Saturday.
Shane is stronger and has more pure power. The crucial questions are: will he make enough contact for the power to matter, and will it be enough power to wear Floyd down even if he hits mostly arms & shoulders …that’s why it’s a compelling matchup.
Despite being stronger and a little bit bigger, Shane has not displayed great know-how in using strenght to wear down opponents in ways OTHER THAN punching power. He’s NOT expert at old-school techniques like:
-hooking the arm and walking the opponent to the ropes and pinning him there
-making opponent bear his weight,
-muscling appart the guard to sneak in short uppercurts or pulling away the arm to expose the flank for a second.
Vernon Forrest was able to use many of these AGAINST Shane to good effect in the first fight.
Maybe a couple of boot camps with Hopkins and his Mullahs will help – Mosley showed some some improved ability to tie up against Margarito – but I don’t believe there is enough time left to truly remake Mosley, and I think he’s a creature of instinct and habit in the ring. I expect that Floyd’s craftier infighting skills and younger legs will even out Shane’s advantage in pure strenght.
The one thing I like about this fight is that Floyd tends to stay outside and potshot. However, Mosley also stays on the outside so Floyd will not be able to do his usual style. Therefore, controlling distance will not be an advantage for Floyd as it has been with almost everyone else. In addition, Mosley has a huge reach.
@bradguy…u got dat right brother. I ain’t buying that bull about Floyd being the GOAT. Dude was great at lightweight. He has not really shown me anything when he went to WW except that he can talk ghetto trash. He is a slick boxer, but not a “fighter”..there’s a difference. Yet, he hasn’t fought anyone on level par. Post-lightweight Mayweather always had some kind of advantage, and his opponenet always seemed to be out of their real fighting weights, ie. Gatti, Marquez, and Hatton. I hope Mosley wins, or at least has a good showing to exposes Floyd’s vulnerabilities….a lot of people out there, including Floyd, don’t think he can be beat…he’s a man..he can lose.
Morales, Barrera, Diaz, De La Hoya, Hatton, Cotto and Clottey are they good for nothing kind of boxer?…they are all beaten by Pacquiao…who else? but two more days to go and we will see “who”…there’s a sign of nervousness and uncertainty in the beginning rounds when Floyd fought De La Hoya, he was scared at first and he only found confidence when Oscar get tired, that’s the time he punched w/heart and he bit Oscar by split decision..Mosley is older but bigger and stronger..Mosley knows in his heart that Floyd is scared to fight quality boxer like he is, Mosley in his style againts Floyd is very intimidating and may be the chiropractor is right, there’s a possibility that if Mosley keep on punching Floyd shoulder,it will break and take out the defense then Floyd will fight him back punch for punch…then we know already what will happen….remember Floyd is not Ali..Ali doesn’t want to engage, he always dance and jab and hold but he is durable…
Certainly, there’s no big difference in size between the two protagonist, unlike Clottey’s huge advantage in size to that of the Pacman. The fight will be determined as to who gets the upperhand by the 3rd round. Obviously, if Mosley mimicks the “100-punch per round combo” of Pacquiao in the first three rounds, then Floyd will be in for the “grave” of his life. However, if Floyd will be able to do Clottey’s turtle shell defense, then their fight will be a total repeat of Pacquiao-Clottey duel last March. Either way, the fight would be good enough to keep us stay glued on our TV sets… not need to watch live or the PPV.
Who was this welterweight who claims to be the best boxer ever by having a perfect record of 40-0? and claim that he better than Ali and Sugar Ray Robinson?
Well lets examine if his record is really close to those boxers who’s name were mentioned in the Hall of Fame.
George Foreman was 40-0 when he was defeated by Muhammad Ali. Not bad.
Larry Holmes went 48-0 before losing to Michael Spinks. Even better.
Rocky Marciano retired at 49-0, with 43 knockouts.
Julio Cesar Chavez won his first 88 fights (yes, 88) before he finally suffered a draw against Pernell Whitaker.
Packy McFarland lost his first fight. But he went ahead and won his next 98 fights.
Willie Pep won his first 62 fights, lost one, then won his next 72 bouts. That put him at 134-1, at that point.
The officially awarded greatest of all time, Sugar Ray Robinson, was 128-1 in the prime of his career. He finished his career at 173-19 with 108 KOs.
Which record do you think is far better than the other? 40-0 or 134-1?.
Not only did These Hall of Famers have outstanding records, they built their tremendous stacks of stats without cherry-picking their opponents. The afore-mentioned pugilists fought everybody that was willing to step into the ring with them.
Who was that other guy again? Oh yeah, Fraud “The mongoloid” Gayweather, The Greatest self Proclaiming Boxer Ever after Ali. The Man who belongs to a family of “Hustlers” (in Drugs, Gunfiring, Battering Woman, etc) and a mind poisoner (great deciever).
fraudy floyd for the first time had to fight an elite boxer. lol for the first time he had to earn money the same way as others have and not just do hustle fights. after this bout with mosley, am sure he is back to the same ball game, doing hustle fights and gbp will make it look a legitimate match too. gbp and fraudy floyd have robbed people of thier hard earned money and will continue to do so for as long as thier are buyers of fraudy’s PPV fights.
Alot of PBF’s opponents are misled into thinking they will be able to bully PBF. Some have found out the hard way that they were badly mistaken. Guys like Manfredy and Corrales thought that they were the puncher. Maybe PBF’s nickname misled people into thinking that he’s not tough. Anyway, from some of the things I’ve heard SSM say, I gather he thinks he’s going to bully PBF. If so, then I think SSM is also in for a big surprise.
GOAT, yeah right. FMJ may win this, but he isn’t GOAT or close. Not even in the building.
Shane Mosley must use a different tactic in order to beat Floyd. He must instill a mental advantage that will build fear in Floyd. A fighter who is scared when he steps inside the ring usually loses. If he does not employ this tactic, there is no way he can beat Floyd once Floyd would be able to study his boxing skills during the fight. He must stay focused, not overly aggressive, because if he does
become to aggressive to knock Floyd out, he will fail. Shane could be lucky to win this one like playing the superlotto when he reads my comment.
If it is clear that Mayweather will win….
….Is there any reason then why he should get any credit for a win if he wins? Is this yet another case of Mayweather picking a safe opponent to notch another win so that he can continue on his path toward retiring unfeated, and join the ranks of other exemplary fighters who retired undefeated, like the Great Sven Ottke? Just curious….
Mosley is going to win. Mayweather Sr. will once again be humiliated, he’s propehsying again of Mosley’s destruction just as he prophesied destruction of Pacquiao against Hatton. And look what happened! Mosley will do to Floyd Jr. what Pacquiao has done to Hatton! Bold prediction?
I just wish Shane can give Floyd his SECOND LOSS, after his defeat in Olympics Seoul Korea by the Bulgarian Toporov and finishes 3rd place.
Das, while i do admire your research ability, i definitely tend to disagree with your line of reasoning. maybe it’s because i’m in my thirties, but i definitely don’t buy into this “no one can be greater than robinson and ali” mess. sure robinson, pep, and mcfarland fought and won a zillion times. but saying that is akin to satan quoting only the first half of a scripture. any logical argument about historical records must be dissected under the same microscope we use now. it was VERY common at those times to face the same boxer 6 or seven times in your career. Even after beating them decisively. Could you imagine floyd beating corrales like a drum six more times. Or floyd fighting zab or castillo 5 times in our current era. He’d be crucified worse than he is now. Not only that, but when we talk about floyd not facing 40 quality fighters in a row, the same must be applied to the “old timers”. Brace yourselves, but please someone, without looking….name 30…..no, name just 20 championship level fighters that sugar ray robinson faced. Not title challengers, but true championship level prize fighters. We laugh at jones jr. fighting cops and firemen, but a lot of guys back then had no business being in the squared circle. (NO HE DIDN’T) Yes, i did. if i fought my cousin chooty beeks 6 times after i already pummeled him, the next six times would not get any better unless i tripped over my bike or a tree stump…..anyway. don’t get me wrong, i don’t think floyd is the GOAT or a nice guy, but i think that someone needs to present a better argument than “he didn’t fight 200 guys”. I definitely think that if someone thinks he is the GOAT, then they have a valid argument. I do also think that floyd kind of validated his statement by saying that if YOU don’t think you’re the GOAT, you have no business prize fighting. boxing has come a long way since those days. Case in point: Would i say that kobe or lebron are better than jordan. YES! I think if jordan uses the same skill set now that he used to dominate back in his hey day, he would find himself on the wrong end of lebron’s testicles. I guess it all depends on what constitutes the parameters of your GOAT list. BTW, Mosely could dominate this fight if he overwhelms floyd with a combination of power and speed. He would have to step out of himself and be a stronger version of PAC as far as punching volume is concerned. I think the size difference will be a non factor as we’ve seen floyd’s ring generalship neutralize a tall fighter’s advantage.
Whiner, u hit the nail on the head!!!! Whats gonna happen to Shane when he realizes that Floyd can actually fight and that he’s not all that much stronger than he thinks. Its gonna be funny when Shane tries to fight inside with Floyd and realizes that Floyd is one of the best inside Fighters that ever lived (remember the Ricky Hatton Fight when he tried to rough Floyd on the ropes and showed him how he got down….When Shane gets beat up like Gatti come Tenth round Brother Naz will throw in the Towel.
Good article but u got it wrong when u said no 2 and no 3. Man Mayeather is no 1 and Mosley is no 2. Pacroid, the cheater, the steroid user is on the bottom of the pile. Just correcting the facts
Fact no 2, who has beaten more unbeaten fighters and yet is accused of cherry picking.
well Mayweather beat Corrales when Corrales was undefeated, evry lightweighter was scared of him. Mayweather destroyed him
Mayweather beat Ndou when he was undefeated, beating everyone.
Mayweather was the first to beat Ricky Hatton when Ricky was unbeaten and had beaten the great Kostya Tsyu.
Mayweather beat the undisputed welterweight champion Carlos Baldomir and went on to beat Zab Judah who was also a welterweight.
Cotto was scared of Mayweather and didnt want to fight Mayweather. Whos fault is that.
LOVE HIM OR HATE HIM
MAYWEATHER IS HE BEST, ENJOY HIS FIGHTS WHILST HE IS AROUND COZHE WONT BE FIGHTING FOREVER.
Dave, You only mentioned two unbeaten fighters… Ndou was not undefeated and had been stopped by a journeyman earlier in his career. Don’t bring up Judah…he had already lost to Carlos Baldomir before Floyd fought him. I can understand him fighting Baldomir, but there was no reason to fight Judah anyways for a bogus IBF title that they let Judah keep because Baldomir didn’t want to pay the sanctioning fee.
I was actually pretty satisfied when he retired…he is an entertaining character. His fights though just don’t deliver. Hopefully Saturday will be a good one.
After Floyd defeats Shane, and he probably will he should get that coward and steroid user Pacquiao to stop being a foolish child and give him the beating of his life. Forgive the run on
Seems like lots of folks here need to come back to reality. I’m not a FMJ fan, but you have to respect the skills. He has very fast hands and feet to go along with great technical boxing ability. His physical assets and conditioning are backed up by a strong boxing mind with the ability to change tactics both offensively and defensively and find what works. The guy is a complete fighter, the only thing we haven’t seen is Floyd get pushed by an equal opponent into a ‘life and death’ fight. I don’t think this is the fight that pushes him there either.
Shane is a good fighter with good, not devestating single punch power at WW, he needs to do it with clean combinations. He does not have the good consistant jab to set up his offense which is necessary against FMJ to hit him with anything clean, let alone a clean combination. He has good handspeed, but less than many Mayweather has fought. Also, technical boxers give Shane problems and technique is what FMJ is all about. Shane will push as hard as he can and very well may win a few rounds on aggression, but his chances of winning are small. As they say styles make fights and Shane does not have the style to give Mayweather alot of trouble.
this fight will not be about who is stronger or who can hit harder or who is faster, its going to be on the game plan,we all know what floyd will do and that will pop shot and use defence, shane will have to punch floyd and will have to keep floyd in one spot on the ropes for atleast a few secounds at a time even if he has to hit floyd on his arms and shoulders maybe throwing a low blow a couple of times to rattle floyd just enough to let him get open and then shane can counter him in the late rounds
I will give credit where it is due, FMJ looked good the other night, did what he was favored to do, but I chose FMJ by way of UD, so it was of no surprise to me. A bit wider margin than I expected, but that is all moot. Anyways, I stand by what I posted earlier in this thread – FMJ is in no way shape or form GOAT. To entertain that idea is laughable. One of the best of this generation? That is possible, even probable. The GOAT nonsense is a knee jerk reaction from nuthuggers – of whatever fighter – after an impressive victory. Happens all the time following the big fights.
>>Mosley did beat Oscar De La Hoya, but is also important to note that (at the time) he was also using steroids and both victories were disputed.
I agree the second fight was disputed but the first fight was a Mosley victory hands down.
I know there is strong evidence that Mosley was on steroids for the second fight but is there any evidence he was using them during the timeframe of the first ODLH fight? If so, they sure did not help him in the two Forrest fights which occurred after.
As for Shane’s record, he could easily only have two defeats on his record if he had not had immediate rematches with fighters that had his number–Wright and Forrest. That would be like Frazier seeking immediate rematches against Foreman. And I think Shane beat Cotto. Then again, I think he lost the second ODLH fight so maybe he could easily have only 3 defeats.
As for Floyd, I think he lost the first Castillo fight (punch stats show Castillo landed more punches) and the second fight was a draw in my eye.
I think this fight is definitely worth the PPV money but I’m out of town at a fraternity reunion so will avoid the media and watch the HBO replay a week later.